current state of russia's military

[Atticus]

Is the russian military still as corrupt and ill-maintained as it has been? i remember seeing a tv program about russian pilots and it was saying that a huge chunk of it's airforce is not usable because they cant afford to repair them. i also found it interesting that Russian pilots only received 20-25 flight training hours a month as opposed to the West's 100+ hours. i'm guessing the same would go for their ground forces. i'm pretty sure they've got stockpiles of old t-55s and t-62s sitting around. although on the news recently i've heard that they just unveiled a new missile defense system. and i know they've got some 5th generation MiGs and Sukhois that are in the works But it's economy is pretty bad right now. So a realistic wargame with the US and modern Russia wouldn't be able to look as realistic as it should without putting it off-balance, right? does anyone know about the US' ties with the Ukraine? Although i don't know how realistic military action between the US and Ukraine is....

[chrisswim]

The economy in russia has been booming, the BRICK countries have done well last few years. Brazil, Russia, India, China & Korea. They may not be allocating a lot of the GDP to the military. Also, do not wish to 'waste' capital on old vehicles that have little value. They sold off and sent tanks to Korea several years ago along with a carrier to settle economic/financial claims and for trade. Since then, their markets have improved dramatically, although much smaller than the US or UK.

[DrBig]

US-Ukraine ties are pretty tight. I should say...US-Anything that's not Russia ties are pretty tight. The USMC has landed in the Crimea at least once in recent years. The Ukraine now looks like it's shaping up to be the political football between the US & Russia, like Poland was between Hitler & Stalin.

[Noble713]

The Russian approach to their military has been to continue developing modern systems to keep their design bureaus busy. If they ever have a domestic need they can simply ramp up production. It keeps their acquisition costs down but they maintain competitive technological capabilities and a strong defense-oriented sector in the economy. Several senior Russian military commanders, as well as Putin, have stated that the nation's primary defense force is the Strategic Rocket Forces (i.e. nukes). There is simply no incentive for the Russians to equip their whole military with Black Eagle tanks and Su-30MKI fighters that will end up not being used, not when they have such a huge stockpile of equipment that is "good enough".

As chris touched on, the Russian economy has been growing by ~7% annually for years now. Combine that with all the money they are making off of oil and things are looking well for them. It's far more important that they develop a professional NCO corps and improve quality of living than buying up the latest and greatest whiz-bang gadgets.

[Atticus]

thanks for the replies guys. very good points. yah i've heard about the Black Eagle and T-95 tank projects. I believe one of them was cancelled, dont remember which one it was though. I know the Russians have also been conducting military operations with the Chinese and have a pretty decent political relationship right now. Could that mean greater tension with the US/West and Russia/China? Seeing as how the Chinese are about to take the next seat at the "superpowers table", and with Russia in the midst of revamping it's military. Or are we on good enough terms with each other that it won't matter. Now as far as their military structure, is it still very corrupt or has that been brought down to a minimum?

thanks again![/url]

[kilroy]

Allot of the high-tech Russian military equipment you hear about actually exists. It’s just not in the hands of the Russian military. In an attempt to survive the economic melt down in the 90s, the Russian military industrial complex developed many of those systems, and sold them abroad. T-90 tanks to India, who now produce it themselves under license, BMP-3s to several Middle Eastern countries, and allot more stuff to china, who I heard recently spent about 80 billion on new high tech hardware for its military, and allot of it came from Russia. The Chinese have been Modernizing there military for over a decade now.

That means that if you want to do a High tech US equipment VS High tech Russian made scenario, you have plenty of Hypothetical options.

US- vs China,
US vs a Radical United Arab coalition,
Heck try this one on for size.

2010, shortly after the US pull-out from Iraq in 2009, Radical forces succeed in overthrowing the king of Saudi Arabia, (much like the shaw in Iran was over thrown)
And a radical oligarchy similar to Iran’s government gains power. Soon after, Saudi Arabia, Iran, the new government of Iraq, and Syria agree on a mutual defense pact, and begin a massive military buildup. Much of it Russian manufacture.

In 2012, an incident on the west bank of Israel prompts an Invasion by the arab coalition which successfully Conquers Israel. As simultaneously Gas prices world wide shoot up to nearly 200$ a barrel.

Multi-national forces, consisting of EEC and the US military intervene.

Say hello to the new German Africa corps.

[Atticus]

hmm. i like that scenario idea. quite interesting. an modernized enemy force capable of giving the US/West a run for their money. Also, Saudi Arabia does have a few export model US M1/A2 abrams, very interesting.

[kgpanzer]

i posted my response separately since it would not allow me to post it here

Cheers
Anthony

[chrisswim]

Despite the economic growth of the Russian economy, they have a declining population, has been in decline in about 1991 or 1992. So they had procreation day! So you can stay home instead of work and procreate. Russia has had 3 or 4 of these and it seems to work with higher level of births nine months later.

So who is going to stay home tomorrow and procreate, just like our Russian friends?

[thenorthman]

It was mentioned that Saudia Arabia has a few of the M1's export models.

Egypt all now has the right to produce the same model under agreements. Not sure if it is up to a full production or what the numbers are. Plus of course this is out of the Ospery book as well but they seem to get there facts generaly correct.

Sean

[dougeagle]

010, shortly after the US pull-out from Iraq in 2009, Radical forces succeed in overthrowing the king of Saudi Arabia, (much like the shaw in Iran was over thrown)
And a radical oligarchy similar to Iran’s government gains power. Soon after, Saudi Arabia, Iran, the new government of Iraq, and Syria agree on a mutual defense pact, and begin a massive military buildup. Much of it Russian manufacture.

In 2012, an incident on the west bank of Israel prompts an Invasion by the arab coalition which successfully Conquers Israel. As simultaneously Gas prices world wide shoot up to nearly 200$ a barrel.

Multi-national forces, consisting of EEC and the US military intervene.

Say hello to the new German Africa corps.

Sounds like a VERY interesting scenario...wait a minute...why not a campaign instead.

[paul]

I like the scenerio Kilroy but make a couple of minor changes. First do the battle with Israel and have Egypt support Israel and the US. This would allow the M1, Strykers, M2/M3's and all the Israeli stuff.

[Timothy OConnor]

The Chinese have been Modernizing there military for over a decade now.

That means that if you want to do a High tech US equipment VS High tech Russian made scenario, you have plenty of Hypothetical options.

US- vs China

Based on recent events I'm building Chinese-based tank and mech infantry battalions to represent near-future forces of a third world nation. China is aggressively pursuing energy resources in South America, Africa, and the Middle East. The current issue of the Economist includes an excellent article about the economic reasons for China's military build-up as well as the nature of the build-up itself.

Unfortunately for those seeking a competent opponent for scenarios involving US forces the Chinese don't appear to be ready for prime time. According to the Economist the Chinese are so worried about revealing their weaknesses that they undertake only very limited joint excercises with Russia and the US. Even these limited excursions have demonstrated extreme weaknesses in Chinese logistics and communications. For these two reason alone for now they lack the ability to project significant force beyond their borders (even an invasion of Taiwan would be extremely problematic.)

On the other hand they've gone as far as adopting US-style uniforms (some Chinese soldiers dislike them) and are replacing thier tradtional AK-47 knock off with a new, modern bullpup assault rifle (QBZ-95) and related squad automtic weapon.

[Timothy OConnor]

Sorry for the multiple posts...not sure how that happened!